Transit Revolt Erupts On Toronto Council

Ttc Karen Stintz Toronto

First Posted: 02/ 6/2012 7:19 am Updated: 02/ 7/2012 10:35 pm




The fight over the future of Toronto's public transportation system will move into the open on Wednesday when city council has a special meeting on how to best spend more than $8 billion in provincial transit funding.


Mayor Rob Ford's plan to bury a large portion of the Eglinton Cross Town route has led TTC chair Karen Stintz to file a petition demanding the special meeting.


The petition asks council to renew its commitment to the 2009 Transit City plan of former mayor David Miller, which calls for light rail lines on Eglinton, Sheppard and Finch Avenues. It would also call for the Scarborough Rapid Transit line to be replaced by an LRT.


Ford is on record saying he wants subways — including an extension of the Sheppard line.


When asked about the petition on Monday, Ford refused to be drawn out.


Stintz said the mayor's plan is not doable. "There's no funded subway plan. An underground LRT is not a subway," she said.


The issue re-emerged in late January when Stintz proposed — with the knowledge of the mayor's office — a compromise plan for the Eglinton section of the line.


Instead of burying the entire line, Stintz proposed an underground section only in the portion that travels through the centre of the city. The section built east of Laird Drive would be above ground.


Stintz lost a vote at the last TTC board meeting, when other board members — who are also city councillors — voted down a proposal to study the option.


The Eglinton project and the extension of the Sheppard subway are expected to cost about $8.4 billion. Stintz estimated that her proposal would save about $2 billion — and suggested that money could be re-directed to the subway project.


This latest challenge to Mayor Ford comes just a day after city negotiators managed to iron out a last minute deal with CUPE 416, which represents about 6,000 outside workers, including garbage collectors, snow removal workers and paramedics.


Stintz's petition had her signature and the signatures of 23 other councillors.


"I must reiterate: there is no funded subway plan. An underground LRT is not a plan," said Stintz, who also admitted she will probably be replaced as TTC chair.


Stintz said the emergency meeting is needed so the provincial agency Metrolinx can be assured council is behind a single transit plan.


Metrolinx chairman Rob Prichard sent a letter last week asking for that kind of clarity from city council.


Also Monday, Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty said that the province would listen to what Toronto council has to say, should a decision be made to alter the current transit plan.


“We’re looking for the council to do one of two things: either affirm the agreement that we’ve already entered into and which work is proceeding, or, if you want to make a change to that, then you need to do that as a council,” McGuinty said.


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The fight over the future of Toronto's public transportation system will move into the open on Wednesday when city council has a special meeting on how to best s...
The fight over the future of Toronto's public transportation system will move into the open on Wednesday when city council has a special meeting on how to best s...
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12:02 AM on 02/08/2012
Is that a photo of Rob Ford studying his latest strategy on the back of a napkin?
11:25 PM on 02/06/2012
I didn't really understand this issue until I heard Karen Stintz interviewed on radio late today. The Scarborough LRT is already been decided on. The issue is whether it's underground at much greater cost or above ground. Karen Stintz thinks the extra money to put it underground could be better spent on actual subway lines in other areas of the city. I agree with this. The media has tried to put Karen Stintz at odds with the Mayor to create more tension than there already is. This is what the media does. I disagree with the Mayor regarding spending more money to put the Scarborough LRT underground. If we are going underground, it should only be for a high speed, high capacity subway line.
08:32 PM on 02/06/2012
Rob Ford plain and simple is just not qualified to hold such high elected office, this is but another example of his incompetance.
08:48 AM on 02/07/2012
Amen to that.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cinderelladressmaker
07:13 PM on 02/06/2012
cont'd
By the way the City of Toronto in its grand wisdom did those of us at Yonge/Eglinton no favours when they proclaimed that our area should be more dense due to the fact that we have a subway stop here. I don't take the subway during the morning rush hour, but I am told it is already hell, can you imagine what it will be like in a couple of years from now? Our roads here are old and too narrow for all the vehicle traffic that a condo brings. The better way to have gone is to have told developers to build 'NO parking' condos only. I constantly see fire trucks on the way to a call stopped behind stop and go traffic or some moron parked on my narrow street while they are in T. Hortons!I agree with 'cdncommentator' Scarborough isn't dense enough to merit a subway line. A dedicated streetcar line or LRT would make it more accessible to everyone. If they were to put a subway along Eglinton, where would the few stops be and how would all the customers in between the few stops access it? But bottom line, WE CAN NOT AFFORD TO BUILD A SUBWAY LINE!!! Either financially or with the dusty dispruptive mess that it brings. This stubborn pig headed mayor has to rethink his ideas. When he gets a degree in Urban Planning, maybe then I will listen to him.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cinderelladressmaker
07:12 PM on 02/06/2012
I have lived at Yonge/Eglinton for years. Most Sundays I take a bus out to Vic Park/Warden to shop. I usually wait for quite a while for the Eglinton East bus and when it does finally come it is packed. So why if the politicians and the TTC seem to think that this is an important artery that is worthy of a subway or LRT, would they not put on more buses than it currently has??? By the way, while waiting for that jam packed bus I always see numerous Lawrence East and Leslie Street buses going by, EMPTY!!! This isn't just going on during my Sunday rides, I see it so often when at the intersection of Yonge/Eglinton.
I work at Yonge/Sheppard, a ridiculously condo dense area. The only density I see on the Sheppard line is at Bayview. But I chalk that up to it being a main artery and its proximity to the 401. The Don Mills/Sheppard area has always been dense with rental apartments. To be cont'd
06:30 PM on 02/06/2012
Won't be long, he will die of a heart attack in the near future. He sweats constantly, is always beat red, cannot walk to save his life. Those baby steps around the mall are not nearly what is needed to get into shape. He is a walking dead man, cholesterol popsickle.
03:13 PM on 02/06/2012
Let this be a sesson to other electorates: Vote in haste and repent at leisure.
03:00 PM on 02/06/2012
Emperor Ford needs to be run out of town !

His Harper-centric dictatorial manner will not succeed in Toronto.
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Spanky McFarlane
ILLEGITIMUS NON CARBORUNDUM.
02:39 PM on 02/06/2012
Ha ha, Watch Rob Ford "CHEW, CHEW " thru $8 Billion dollars!
12:59 PM on 02/06/2012
The subway is a real gravy train. To support a subway one needs population density. Without it it is a total bust. LRT is cheaper and better and Toronto needs it now. Not after it has beggared itself on an unneeded subway. What kind of lunatic would close essential services down and put a king's ransome into a subway where a subway isn't needed. Would somebody please call call 911 and tell them a lunatic is on the loose and is closing needed services such as libraries and builing a subway which isn't needed while epriving the poor districts in Toronto of needed public transit, libraries and various other things he has chosen to call "gravy trains'
12:56 PM on 02/06/2012
Go Karen Stintz!! :D
12:38 PM on 02/06/2012
I have great respect for Karen Stintz. She is very smart, insightful and careful with our money. However, subways attract density that is not be there now. Look at all the density that has developed along the Sheppard line. Scarborough has a lot of area that could be redeveloped based on higher capacity subway service. In Montreal, people do not need to own a car because the network of subway stations is so vast. Toronto citizens cannot imagine what our city will be like in ten years if there can be no new roads built. A subway network that is as large as Montreal is the only way to go to avoid more severe gridlock and severe wear and tear on the roads. Gas prices will be over $2 a liter in less than five years and car travel will become too costly for many younger, middle class people who need to get to work but still afford Toronto housing costs. We need to minimize the use of cars and an expanded subway system is the only answer. LRT's that are partially above ground will not have enough capacity or speed to get people out of their cars and handle another 1 to 2 million of population in the GTA.
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GeoToronto
Nik Nak Paddy Wak, Still Ridin' Caddy-Laks
12:52 PM on 02/06/2012
I agree with your point about Stinz being smart etc. but I disagree with your point about subways bringing density. The subway may bring density, but tax payers/TTC riders are footing the bill for the density, once you plunk a subway station in a neighbourhood the surrounding land doubles in value, thats all well and good, but why should my tax money reward developers and real etestate speculators. I see 2 options that would serve everyone better, the city/prov, feds should promise a subway only when neighbourhood density hits a certian density or in areas where the densities aren't there, developers should help finance/subsidize the projects.
05:49 PM on 02/06/2012
"Developers should help finance/subsidize the projects". They already do.
01:44 PM on 02/06/2012
Density has usually come from two things, jobs or fast transportation to jobs. Expecting density where one of these does not now exist, won't happen. There is now much more density and property tax revenue for the city from the Sheppard line but that density was not there before the line was built and has flourished since. I agree that developers should help fund the building of subway stations if their developments will benefit directly. Developers get rich from big risk-taking,
"lobbying" politicians, and building what people want. You cannot deny them their right to make a lot of money, but you can tax them after that money is made. The city land transfer tax is huge tax grab just at the time when a buyer can least afford it. But for every townhome / condo unit that a developer builds, the city gets a ridiculous and unfair windfall of land transfer tax and then again when the unit resells, as well as additional annual property taxes. These new unit owners also increase ridership of public transportation which contributes to operating costs. l. Developers are what bring density. They are a necessary evil. A major Toronto developer had to build a new school at their own expense in order to build their condo towers. That works for me.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cdncommentator
12:06 PM on 02/06/2012
Here Karen Stintz has indentified real gravy and is cutting it out and putting money where it will meet the most needs. Scarborough and the suburbs are too low density to merit a subway line. They can accommodate a street level LRT line. Subways make sense in dense urban areas. Scarborough is neither dense nor urban. Same with Eglinton west of Jane St.

If the city has limited funds to work with, it should use them to address the most pressing issues. Karen Stintz has seen the light. If Ford's plan goes ahead, nothing will happen because there's no money, public support or political will for it. I'm afraid Ford will make the city stagnate for 4 years.
11:58 AM on 02/06/2012
The many FACES of Karen Stintz.
11:56 AM on 02/06/2012
The many FACES of Karen Stintz. No trust with this one.