Toronto Transit: Dalton McGuinty Says Rob Ford's Subway Plan Is A No-Go Without City Council Support

Ttc Toronto Transit Subway

First Posted: 02/ 9/2012 3:39 pm Updated: 02/10/2012 10:35 am

OTTAWA - Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty says he must respect Toronto city council's decision on the future of the city's transit.

And if that means light rail instead of Mayor Rob Ford's vision for more subways, then so be it.

This week, Ford and his allies lost a crucial transit battle when council instead voted to revive an above-ground, light-rail plan.

The mayor insisted the vote was meaningless because the province would still go ahead with his subway plan.

After Wednesday's vote, Ford posted a message on his Facebook page reiterating his pledge to bring a subway line to Toronto's east end.

"The residents of Scarborough, Toronto's fastest-growing region, deserve underground rapid transit — and I promised to deliver it to them. Today's vote does not change my promise," Ford wrote.

"Great cities, like Paris, London and New York were built around long-term transit visions 100 years ago. Subways in Scarborough represent that long-term vision for our great city."

But McGuinty says he has been clear with Ford that the mayor needs the support of council before any subway plan goes ahead.

"Just as I appreciate the clarity that has been introduced into this in terms of the direction the City of Toronto wants to pursue for public transit, I've also been very clear with the mayor from Day 1," he said.

"At the time the memorandum of understanding was entered into, there was a specific provision that he's got to seek the support of the council.

"When I spoke with him — he reached out to me just last Friday — I confirmed once again that I needed the approval of the council. Should he receive that, great, we're off to the races. Should he not receive that, I told him, should council decide they want to pursue another direction, that is something I feel obligated to consider."

Councillors voted for a plan to put light-rail lines on Eglinton Avenue and Finch Avenue West, and to study a subway extension on Sheppard Avenue. Ontario Transportation Minister Bob Chiarelli told reporters at Queen's Park the province is waiting for the results of that study.

"I want to be clear that the plan endorsed yesterday by council is still very much a work in progress," Chiarelli said.

"While council has in fact prioritized three LRT lines — the Scarborough LRT, the Finch West LRT, and the Eglinton Crosstown LRT — they have also deferred judgment on the Sheppard Avenue corridor."

Earlier, a small group of protesters interrupted the premier's lunchtime speech to the Canadian Club.

— With files from Maria Babbage in Toronto

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Toronto Twitter users have been following the transit debate at city hall. Many councillors have been discussing the St. Clair streetcar right of way, calling the project a disaster.

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OTTAWA - Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty says he must respect Toronto city council's decision on the future of the city's transit.And if that means light rail instead of Mayor Rob Ford's vision for mo...
OTTAWA - Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty says he must respect Toronto city council's decision on the future of the city's transit.And if that means light rail instead of Mayor Rob Ford's vision for mo...
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01:28 PM on 02/22/2012
Do yourselves a favour and use the resources available. Take a leisurley stroll on Google Streetview and see what a "boon" to the Eastern Danforth the existing Subway has been...and it's already had decades. Pay particular attention to what is called the mid-block conditions inbetween Subway stops.

Then do the same to St. Clair.

A Subway essentially holds the commuters hostage until they make it to their stops...Mid block retail properties lose the street traffic and their values plummet.

Toronto Archives in their City hall library have about 40 years of aerial photos as well...If you put a Subway under an area of insufficient density, you suck the life out of it.
yer
Stop the Alberta Taliban
09:56 AM on 02/13/2012
For the steadfastly ignorant, there is information freely available to explain much of what is going on. That will not be in the media nor from Ford Nation. Try Steve Munro's website (http://www.stevemunro.ca) and the city staff reports. Try the transit city poster here http://www.tinyurl.com/transitcityposter

Or not. But if you haven't a clue, by all means show us no ability to understand and rationalize what is happening. Be a Kent if you want, but please make sure that you have no idea.

As long as Toronto is still politically connected to the new suburbs, there will be more transit in Toronto. If you don't like that then please vote to secede from amalgamation, but spare us the analysis.
01:42 AM on 02/13/2012
Sadly I suspect that the only reason many in city council are opposing the subway plan is because Ford got elected on it.

From it's inception the light rail plan was short sited and only picked because it cost less. Council should be planing for the next 50 or so years. Amortize the cost out and the differences become moot. There is no doubt that subway is safer and has vastly less of an impact on traffic.
yer
Stop the Alberta Taliban
09:40 AM on 02/13/2012
please travel first
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
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07:47 AM on 02/12/2012
How come he is still there?
Must be Hudak..
10:56 PM on 02/11/2012
I just can;t understand why some body would give me such a stupit answer ,well ,it wasn't really an answer,it was most like a snide remark, and for that 'person' who doesn't know me ,that really hurts.in reguarding what happened to the old toronto PPC street cars.are you listining solex.?
10:26 PM on 02/11/2012
I'm not a ford fan ( hes actually ajerk off), But ther is no more room for above ground transit.. I agree we need subways..
01:39 AM on 02/13/2012
Agreed 100%
08:28 AM on 02/13/2012
And where does the money come from?
10:41 PM on 02/10/2012
Mayor Ford was elected by the tax payers of this city to do the right thing, unfortunately these left wing Millerites cronies wants to continue with their wasteful spending in the city.

Obviously they have not learned from the useless Scarborough light rail system which only seem to work in the warm weather in addition they built the nightmare on StClair but once again they want to have their own way embarking on stupid projects and wasting the tax payers money.

Mayor Ford is proposing a solid underground system and he should stick to his guns or cancel the whole darn project because if he does not build it underground, I am certain that it will be another nightmare and a waste of time.
yer
Stop the Alberta Taliban
09:44 AM on 02/13/2012
the only waste of time is believing that subways are cheaper than LRTs. It turns out for the cost of one we can have a transit connected city for the same price.

http://www.tinyurl.com/transitcityposter
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Spanky McFarlane
ILLEGITIMUS NON CARBORUNDUM.
05:09 AM on 02/10/2012
I think Mr. Ford should call 911 on the last four posters as they seem to be picking on him! (snicker)
12:20 AM on 02/10/2012
Democracy be damned eh Ford?
10:12 PM on 02/09/2012
Well done Toronto. Your chance of becoming a world class city is now even further from reach. Running an LRT down an already existant street is not going to lessen the congestion which is the main problem that Toronto faces. Why would I leave my car at home, to get onto an LRT where I will go down a street and not only stop at all the same traffic lights that I would if I was in my car, but also now each LRT stop? Not at all efficient. A person is not going to give up their vehicle to get onto a transit system that will take them even longer to get where they need to go. Why is the subway successful? Because it is faster than driving. Why is the GO train successful? Because it is faster than driving. LRTs may 'service' more people, but the real question is how many people will actually USE them?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
FearlessFreep
A radical leftist with a JS Woodsworth avatar.
12:50 PM on 02/10/2012
I live near St. Clair West, and can affirm that now that construction is finally finished, the neighborhood is benefiting greatly from the dedicated streetcar lanes.
yer
Stop the Alberta Taliban
09:46 AM on 02/13/2012
see for yourself

http://www.tinyurl.com/transitcityposter
05:36 PM on 02/09/2012
I sure miss the old PCC street cars,not liking the newer style of cars.wondering what happened to the older cars,?
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Solex
07:11 PM on 02/10/2012
The older cars are retired to the Halton Railway, where they should stay as well-Toronto needs to go forward with it's streetcars, not back. If you want to do that, may I suggest you look for a streetcar train set, buy it, and run it to your heart's content.
12:47 PM on 02/11/2012
solex,,WHY such an arrogant rely?
08:53 PM on 02/11/2012
that should have read REPLY
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
toofarleft4thisworld
The Right Is So Wrong
05:00 PM on 02/09/2012
LRT will service more people for less money. Council rules.
10:44 PM on 02/10/2012
your name says it all buddy !! The gravy train has to stop.
yer
Stop the Alberta Taliban
09:45 AM on 02/13/2012
you mean subways?

http://www.tinyurl.com/transitcityposter
01:45 AM on 02/13/2012
The LRT will not service more people because fewer people will use it, compared to a subway. It will also add to traffic congestion rather than help to relieve it which means that it will actually cost the city vastly more in added fuel costs (don't forget the motorists) and increased traffice accidents.

Like so many things if you buy cheap you get cheap.
yer
Stop the Alberta Taliban
09:42 AM on 02/13/2012
there are not enough people to justify the cost of a subway and the LRT will manage whatever load is there.

the design plan is to last until 2051.

I read the city staff reports and notes from steve munro's website and thus I am informed about the why's.