Long-Gun Registry: Quebec Court Orders Delay In Destruction Of Records

Posted: 04/ 5/2012 10:17 am Updated: 04/10/2012 12:26 pm

Long Gun Registry Quebec
Ministers from the Harper government are set to celebrate the official end of the oft-maligned long-gun registry this morning following the passage at third reading late Wednesday of C-19, the Conservatives' bill to not only end the registry, but destroy all the data it contains about registered gun owners across Canada, a move opposed by Quebec. (CP/Alamy)

MONTREAL - The federal long-gun registry might die — but it's not happening today.

A Quebec court has stepped in and ordered a delay in the destruction of registry data from that province, following a request by the Quebec government.

The court has granted the delay until further motions are argued in court next week.

The legal battle is playing out in Montreal while, in Ottawa, legislation to kill the registry has sailed through the Senate and is set to receive royal assent today.

The feds say they plan to begin the process of deleting the registry data immediately. A federal lawyer told the court that royal assent takes effect at midnight.

Now Quebec can keep up the fight in court next week to save the information. It wants the data to create its own registry.

It argues that it's unconstitutional for the federal government to destroy the information, if it means thwarting the public policy of another level of government.

The registry battle has been particularly emotional in Quebec, which was the epicentre of the national gun-control movement after the Polytechnique massacre of 1989.

The Quebec government has never accepted the view of registry critics, like the Harper Tories, who call the measure useless in deterring violent crime.

The court order today applies only to data from Quebec. Information from other provinces is still subject to destruction — although a government lawyer says that deletion process won't be so easy, and might actually take months.

Related on HuffPost:

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  • What does this new bill on the gun registry do?

    We keep hearing about scrapping the long-gun registry, but really what we're talking about is scrapping the requirement for people to register their rifles and shotguns - that's what Bill C-19 aims to do by making amendments to the Criminal Code and Firearms Act. Once passed, people will not have to register their non-restricted or non-prohibited firearms. It also provides for the destruction of existing records in the Canadian Firearms Registry for those firearms. <em>With files from CBC</em>

  • What exactly is the registry?

    It's a centralized database overseen by the Royal Canadian Mounted Police that links firearms with their licensed owners. It contains information about all three types of guns that must be registered - non-restricted, restricted and prohibited. (All firearms must be registered.) To register a firearm, you have to have a licence to possess it.

  • Does the bill make any changes to licensing requirements?

    No. Canadian residents need a licence in order to possess and register a firearm or ammunition and that won't change. There are a couple of different kinds of licences because of various changes to laws and regulations over the years.

  • What are long guns?

    There are three types of guns under Canadian law: non-restricted, restricted and prohibited. Most common long guns - rifles and shotguns - are non-restricted but there are a few exceptions. A sawed-off shotgun, for example, is a prohibited firearm. A handgun is an example of a restricted firearm. Different regulations apply to different classifications of firearms.

  • How many guns are we talking about?

    As of September 2011, there were about 7.8 million registered guns. Of those, 7.1 million are non-restricted firearms.

  • Why does the government want to get rid of the long-gun registry?

    The government says it is wasteful and ineffective at reducing crime and targets law-abiding gun owners instead of criminals, who don't register their firearms.

  • Who wants to keep it?

    Police and victims' groups are big supporters of the registry. Police say the database helps them evaluate a potential safety threat when they pull a vehicle over or are called to a residence. They also say it helps support police investigations because the registry can help determine if a gun was stolen, illegally imported, acquired or manufactured. This year, the RCMP says police agencies accessed it on average more than 17,000 times a day.

  • When will the registry cease to exist?

    The government has passed the legislation and the registry no longer exists. Except for in Quebec, where an ongoing court challenge means the owners must still register their guns in the province.

  • Why does the government want to destroy the records?

    The government is doing this to ensure that no future non-Conservative government can recreate the registry. Public Safety Minister Vic Toews has also made it clear that if any province wants to set up its own registry it would get no help from the federal government. The Conservatives are so fundamentally opposed to the existence of the records, because they say they focus on law-abiding citizens instead of criminals, that they don't want them available for anyone to use.

  • How much does the registry cost?

    The registry cost more than $1 billion to set up in 1995 and the cost was the source of much controversy. Public Safety Minister Vic Toews said on Oct. 25 that the government's best estimate is that it costs about $22 million a year to operate. That's the entire registry, not just the long-gun portion, but he noted most of the guns in the registry are long guns. He said he didn't know how much money scrapping the requirement to register long guns would save the government. Conservative MP Candice Hoeppner says there are also "hidden costs" that are borne by provincial and municipal police agencies to enforce the registry.

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MONTREAL - The federal long-gun registry might die — but it's not happening today.A Quebec court has stepped in and ordered a delay in the destruction of registry data from that province, following ...
MONTREAL - The federal long-gun registry might die — but it's not happening today.A Quebec court has stepped in and ordered a delay in the destruction of registry data from that province, following ...
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butchcliff
The future is unwritten
07:38 AM on 04/10/2012
If Quebec wants its own registry, let them, use money they can't afford. They'll probably 'Demand' money from the Federal Govt
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Eileen Warren
10:21 PM on 04/06/2012
Let me see now,whoever wanted to could look into files of our veterans but this registry cannot be shared?What privacy issues are involved here?
01:02 PM on 04/06/2012
Thank Harper, someone who is doing what he says with 9 happy provinces. Anyone who owns, has owned or knows someone who owns a firearm is delighted.
Quebec, its all about the politics, they will never start a registry, but they will milk it for whatever they can
10:40 AM on 04/06/2012
Gun registry? including FAC. I as a aboriginal without an FAC can not physically go and feed my family. You people that are supporting these programs may wanna stop and think about this. You probably do not have to hunt and fish for your livelihood. Please take a minute to reflect on this, also the gun registry program cost Canadian tax payers, you, me and all Canadians who pay taxes 2 billion dollars. Don't you know this? Why are those people who wasted this money not in jail? That is what we call theft.

Also someone commented about democracy we do not have democracy , we may call it democracy. What happens when elected officials get elected? They go away and waste Canadian taxpayers money and don't have to be accountable. Also they never come back to ask Canadians what we really need or want.
Wake up and smell the coffee!
03:52 AM on 04/06/2012
What is the point to God Dammit....we are right!

Harper and his Haters have had their way but it is not quite enough, they have to just twist the knife a little more.

Quite sick in my view, and what we saw in BC with the fast ferries. Campbell sold them for less then scrap value to make a point and cost taxpayers a bundle. I'm so sick of self-interested politicians. When will they show interest in the taxpayer? So right wing to ignore us.
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colpy
08:09 AM on 04/06/2012
What are you talking about??

Harper was elected in no small part because he promised to trash the long gun registry. He is simply fulfilling an election promise.

That is a good thing.
12:16 PM on 04/06/2012
If Quebec wants to continue with a registry of their own, why not let them have the already bought and paid for data base of gun ownership records? To want to destroy them is just wasteful and vindictive.
02:43 AM on 04/06/2012
What could possibly be gained from destroying this information? Some will probably object that governments shouldn't be able to keep that kind of information about citizens, but the truth is that the government already has tons of info on you. It is what enables them to do their job. Can it be abused? Sure, but I don't see that happening with this registry.

Also, what right does the federal government have to destroy information held by a provincial government? THAT is government overreach. The people of Quebec have made it clear that they want to keep this information, and the federal government shouldn't be able to interfere with their jurisdiction.
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colpy
08:14 AM on 04/06/2012
Ahhh....the Firearms Act is federal criminal code legislation. The registry is a federal institution. The data was collected for the express purpose of creating a federal registry. No part of the data belongs to any province.

The legal requirement under the federal criminal code for that registry no longer exists.

The election promise made was to "dismantle the registry".

Simply put, the data IS the registry.

The federal gov't has promised, and therefore has an obligation to "dismantle the registry", thus to destroy the records.
07:56 PM on 04/06/2012
Fair enough, but what is to be gained thereby?
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Marg Wood
Peace
07:30 PM on 04/06/2012
Its ok to invade peoples privacy over the internet but its not ok to have the names of people with registered guns???
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nikki717
War...what is it good for?
07:07 AM on 04/07/2012
Agreed. What Hypocracy
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02:19 AM on 04/06/2012
I still don't understand why having guns registered is a bad thing. The money had already been spent. Fine, they're owned by law-abiding citizens. Isn't it still useful to know where the darned guns are? Yes, the bad guys don't register theirs -- but I don't really understand that argument. We register vehicles.

Sure, there might be unregistered guns in a home police were going to, the argument goes (why register any guns when illegal guns won't be registerd?) but wasn't it helpful to police to know when there were registered guns there?

It would be interesting to see if gun accidents went down because of the registry. As someone who doesn't own guns, how is registry and requiring them to be locked up infringe on citizen's rights?
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colpy
08:18 AM on 04/06/2012
Because registering guns leads inevitably to confiscation of those firearms.

This has happened several times in Canada as the gov't decides some class of firearms bought perfectly legally really is a danger, and re-classifies them as prohibited, and goes around collecting them. The RCMP just finished doing this to two different .22 rimfire rifles that weren't asthetically politically correct.

Registration means confiscation.
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09:51 AM on 04/09/2012
And we can expect our registered automobiles to be confiscated - when?

It's inevitable, right?
01:33 AM on 04/06/2012
32 minutes and counting, billions of tax payers dollars up in flames................and loving it!
Good riddance to the registry. Can't wait to see what rediculous initiative is next.
I suppose I should keep the barrels I had my guns hidden in for when they come after my kitchen knives............
Ahh the nanny state, if you can get over the frustration, it can be quite entertaining at times.
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10:04 AM on 04/09/2012
So you hid your guns in barrels to avoid having to register your guns.

Another "law-abiding" citizen unfairly targeted by the government, I suppose.

Why is it that people with your level of reasoning power always support the Conservatives?
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colpy
05:44 PM on 04/09/2012
The dangerous people are those that always bow to the will of the state.
01:28 PM on 04/09/2012
Exactly where in any of my posts did I mention that I support the Conservatives in any way, shape or form? For that matter, any branch of the Government?
If you want to know where I stand on an issue, ask me. For the record, in my opinion, Harper and his pals should be in jail. Hows that grab ya?
You may want to evaluate your comprehension skills prior to commenting on other peoples "level of reasoning power" my friend.
01:14 AM on 04/06/2012
Every piece of information that is generated by the government has been paid for and is owned by the Canadian people. The people and government of Quebec and any other Canadian people have a right to it. To destroy it is to burn the taxpayers money.
01:22 AM on 04/06/2012
You don't mean that. These records contain private information about Canadian citizens. Unless you are willing to send me your private health care info and all the other information you say I am entitled to. If you do that, then I will believe you meant it.
The registry is no longer law therefore the information gathered for its use is no longer necessary to be held for the very reason that it may be misused.
03:09 AM on 04/06/2012
In my personal case, I would not care what information that the government gathers on me is made public, if all others is also made public.
I did not go into great length in my post as to how I also consider the privacy laws to be vital. Trouble with posting is keeping it less than novel length. There is a balance of public and private. But I still say the data is ours. Keep it. Use it as legal, with respect to law. I am very happy that Statistics Canada data is now being let out at less or no cost to citizens, seeing as we paid to have the data collected. The firearms registry data is of use to law enforcement. Not perfect, but helpful and sometimes vital.
If it is the specter of confiscation of firearms that worries you, have a good hiding place ready to use. If it is just about any sort of registration and info about you being required, exit society. We share the land, some info is required for that.
03:19 AM on 04/06/2012
Here is my health situation. I have Crohns colitis, I smoke, having a rum and coke right now. Any other info isn't that interesting. I am going to take the courses and purchase firearms. Considering I have to register my car, I don't mind registering my firearms. I got licenses for my pets. The government doesn't seem to be too interested in anything else but my wage. Well, maybe my phone number and political affiliation for false polling info. If you are worried about the government in your life, information about your firearms is way down the list of how they can mess your life up intentionally or more like by incompetence.
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colpy
08:21 AM on 04/06/2012
Excuse me, but perhaps you could tell me exactly when Quebec became "the people of Canada" over and above the people of ALL of Canada?

The people of ALL of Canada elected the Federal gov't on a platform including the destruction of the registry.

The Liberals burned the money, after they were warned what it would cost.
03:43 PM on 04/06/2012
A lot less than half the people voted for the Conservatives. The fact that we have more than two political parties means the majority do not always get the type of government they voted for. The majority of Canadians did not want the Conservatives.
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Atim-moot Tugayak
Sun News is Dark and Hateful.
11:49 PM on 04/05/2012
A penny says the Cons destroy the records tonight cuz the Judges' order "didn't reach them in time" cuz that's the Con-way. oop, I meant a nickle.
10:16 PM on 04/05/2012
Why not have a Quebec court simply declare Quebec to be a sovereign country and we can dispense with the next tedious referendum?
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Ascoli
07:22 AM on 04/06/2012
OK
Vive Quebec
10:38 PM on 04/07/2012
I am just appalled at the arrogance of your posts and frankly quite amused that there is still discussion about Quebec referendum etc. When you ask the average Quebecer how a society of 8M francophones will survive on a continent of 380M anglos they have no clue. When asked what they would use for currency with a straight face they reply we will keep the canadian dollar. Vive le Quebec libre it was very passionate when deGaulle said it in the 60s but the funny thing is when you ask someone in france about quebecers they laugh and consider them inbred hillbillys...when I see the sense of entitlement by quebecers on this thread I have to shake my head in disgust.
09:54 PM on 04/05/2012
How bout Quebec pays for say 1/4 of the long gun registry and then they get Quebec specific data. We could all get a cheque for $25 to blow on Bear Spray and Gasoline
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Tony frm Banff
Search for truth,not spin
09:12 PM on 04/05/2012
Here is gun crimes per state,.....http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/10/gun-crime-us-state

Would you like to see your Canada with as many gun crimes as one of theses states ????
We need more gun controls on all citizens.
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10:04 PM on 04/05/2012
Why, gun ownership is static and gun crimes are decreasing?
10:10 PM on 04/05/2012
Once again, how will registering a weapon prevent crime, Tony?
I really would love for you to answer this question.

Oh, and you really do need to look at the data you are presenting. It is one hundred percent contradictory to the message you are trying to support.
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grizzly bear55
King of the forest
08:50 PM on 04/05/2012
Only the Federal court has jurisdiction on the Federal Government, the court of Quebec is fooling itself.

The province has to go to the Federal court if they have any chance.

If I lived in Quebec, I would go to court against the province for discrimination, while the rest of the country have a different deal.
08:23 PM on 04/05/2012
We screw up a lot of things in Quebec but copying US policies is not one of our defects. Be wary of right wing propaganda from Fox and friends.
08:29 PM on 04/05/2012
Which specific piece of "propoganda" should we look out for Pal from Quebec?
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Tony frm Banff
Search for truth,not spin
09:13 PM on 04/05/2012
Anything from sun news network is propaganda.
And SNN is based in Quebec.
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grizzly bear55
King of the forest
08:55 PM on 04/05/2012
Quebec lost 2 times $30 billions each time on the stock market and forced the Quebec citizens to pay more taxes to cover up the incompetence of the responsibles who got off Scott free.

The Quebec Pension fund has a huge hole but Quebec can not copy the Federal Government because the Quebec fund is a trust that belong to the tax payers who paid into it.