“Well, if guns start blowing up or malfunctioning when they are used then I say, yeah recall them. They didnt recall pinto's, tylenol, or kids toys because of misuse, they did so because it was a bad product. A gun is designed for on thing, to fire a projectile. Now if someone wants to abuse or misuse the gun, then that is on them, not the product.
You wouldnt recall a kids toy because someone used it as weapon to kill someone, you would recall a vehicle because someone used it to run people over, you wouldnt recall medicine because someone slipped it somebody else and they died.
“Call it what you want, its still an accident. Its only negligent homicide if the father gets charged with it. But he was negligent, and this accident was 100% preventable. But its up to the PA to decide if there will be charges.”
“Easy to say, except things that kill way more people are not taken off the market.”
Please Be Rational on Jun 17, 2014 at 02:13:51
“It only took 27 deaths with the Ford Pinto. Six (6) deaths with Tylenol Capsules. And things that kill children? Usually one or two and the toy, swing, etc. is off the market. They get pulled really fast.”
I realize that some things are lost when commenting on here, but I promise you my comment about it being a mile stone victory as all facetious and not on ounce of seriousness to it.
Id test it out. But the only problem is I dont open carry, unless Im at work. If I was at work I know for sure they wouldnt have an issue with me carrying, if I was off of work, they wouldnt even know I was carrying, so whats a guy to do. Plus there is thousands of places to eat, that like Starbucks, simply follow the state laws regarding firearms. There is everything from fine dinning to fast food.”
“Thats fine, it does not bother me one bit if you leave or stay. If guns make you that uncomfortable I would suggest taking some training, even if you dont want to own one, you could at least familiarize your self with them and get some exposure to the gun culture. The kind of people who do carry are lawyers, doctors, teachers, students....just normal everyday people. The people that hold doors open for you, they guy waiting in line next you at the store, or the people eating int he booth next to yours. They are everywhere. There is a million different reasons to carry and that is all on the individual. No one gets the luxury of choosing the time and place when they might need to defend themselves, it just happens with out warning. But keep in mind that less than 1% of the population actually harms others, so your chances are very low of becoming a victim, but it still happens. Even most police agree and here is a link to prove it.
“Thanks for sharing your experience. Im not saying it never happens, but its not very frequent. Also its not just a thousand, its hundreds of thousands up too 3 million times a year according to Obama's gun violence research group. Which is probably the most comprehensive non-bias study ever done on gun violence. Even the Brady Campaign who is the most Anti gun bias group out there says that guns are used at least 80,000 times a year in self defense. So you have a small number of random killings, Vs 80,000-3 million people who are alive today because they had a gun.
If you would like a good break down of gun deaths in America here is a good link.
“Wow, thats a bit if a stretch. You had to really dig deep in the imagination for that. But Hey I dont judge, if thats what you have to do to get through your day then more power to you. I still stand by what I said. If thats their hard line policy, then they should say so, not come out and say please dont do this.
Your problem is, you think you know what everyone is thinking by just reading a couple comments. Just an FYI, I do not think all who support rules like these are anti-gun. I dont think they are very smart, but not all are anti gun.”
MJHammonds on Jun 9, 2014 at 14:28:21
“No imagination necessary.
Guess it is a milestone victory for the anti gun crowd.
Your words. If using the word "asking" in a PR statement is confusing to you, then you are certainly welcome to test that theory. Let us all know how that works out for you.”
“No laws and systems are perfect, why would gun laws be any different?
Lets be real here, where there is a will there is a way.
I disagree with your opinion on the NRA, Im not a huge fan of them and they have said some things that leaves you scratching your head, but they do have a lot of educational programs,and they do have a history of supporting true common sense gun laws.
But like any other lobby group they are going to have a vested interest in what they lobby for.”
“I would say with out a doubt that it happens, but not in large numbers, and people haven't been causing problems, at least not by those who can legally own a firearm. Most often those who are drinking while carrying, cannot be legally carrying anyways because they are felons.....in my experience.”
“I did originally, but then I did a little homework on it, does it make things worse, better, or is there no change. There isnt much data out there on the topic other than the study done in Virgina, which would indicate that it reduces crime in those locations.
I dont care either way if guns are allowed in bars or not, but I do think that if you are drinking in a bar while in possession of a firearm it should be a felony and not a misdemeanor.”
Iluvowls on Jun 4, 2014 at 20:05:25
“So you actually believe that no one who brings a gun into a bar will be drinking?”
In the mean time Ill continue to wait for an example of good guys gone bad. Not bad guys gone bad, lol”
Think before you send on Jun 5, 2014 at 00:36:54
“Shouldn't have... Yes.
Did have... Yes
In the eyes of the NRA and their ilk, if the credit card is good, they are "good guys". Without any real database.... They will always be "good guys" with unlimited access to deadly firearms until they kill. The difference between a heavily armed "bad guy" and a heavily armed "good guy" is a pretty thin line.
I just wish the NRA differentiated between who should and who shouldn't have a gun.
Unfortunately, if they only allowed the qualified and/or sane to be armed, they would not be making record profits for their corporate sponsors.”
“Maybe to put your mind at ease, I did 7 years in the Army as a Scout, I went to sniper school, I was a fire arms instructor, and I spent 26 months in Iraq, after getting injured in Iraq and a couple surgery's later I got out and went into law enforcement where Im currently on the Special Response Team with the Sheriffs office that I work for. So not only is constant training and shooting part of my job, its also one of my hobbies.
I dont want you thinking Im some sovereign citizen living out in the woods stock piling guns, lol”
Suresp77 on Jun 4, 2014 at 11:15:12
“Now that does help, you actually are one of the qualified ones.Thank you for weighing in though, its been educational for me.”
“I can see why you thought I meant 320 million people owned 300 million guns, but thats not the way I intended it. That was poor wording on my part.
There is also studies that show that 47% of households in America own guns, and that gun ownership is the highest its been since the early 90's, then there are studies that show its the lowest its been in 40 years. So which do you go with, the one that best fits your argument of course, but who is right?
I do not think either is correct as most studies tend to be bias.
I like to default back to the most recent and comprehensive study. The one Obama put together a special team to study gun violence after Newtown. Which in the study said that guns are used up to 3 million times a year in defense.
Here is the high lights of the reprot, not really a victory for the pro gun crowd or the anti gun crowd.
“No worries...the word limit here tends to force us to be economical with words...sometimes that can have unintended consequences :-) I am aware of the Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence research paper. It's really just a initial baseline and it's not meant to draw conclusions regarding firearm use per se. I was looking at the Uniform Crime Reports (UCR): In 2010, according to the most recent data on justifiable homicides from the FBI’s Uniform Crime Reporting (UCR) program, there were 230 justifiable homicides involving a private citizen using a firearm in self-defense during either an attempted or a completed crime. In the same year, there were 8,275 firearm homicides. That works out to about 1/36 ratio. Between 2007 and 2011, only 0.8 percent of violent crimes involved the intended victim using a firearm in self-defense. During the same five year period, only 0.1 percent of attempted or completed property crimes involved the intended victim using a firearm in self-defense. Given that between 40-45% of American households own a gun, and less than 0.1 percent of victims of property crime end up using a gun to stop a crime, it’s impossible to suggest that guns are being effectively used in self-defense. The CDC report mentions as as possible 2.5 million incidents, suggesting that self-defense can be an important crime deterrent (Kleck and Gertz, 1995)." However the research done by Kleck and Gertz has been completely discredited. NCVS and UCR produce far better numbers. http://www.stat.duke.edu/~dalene/chance/chanceweb/103.myth0.pdf http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/firearms-research/gun-threats-and-self-defense-gun-use/ http://scholarsandrogues.com/2012/12/25/raw-materials-how-often-are-guns-used-in-self-defense/”
“It seems that there is just a lack of understanding or knowledge on your part, and I do not mean that to be rude. You think that guns only purpose is for killing, and the only logical reason for owning one is hunting. I own a number of firearms and I do not hunt...at all. I do how ever do tactical competitive shooting and a lot of target practice. Its a fun enjoyable sport it is even an Olympic sport.
I dont want you to feel heartened by the fact that your odds of becoming a victim are slim to none, I just to realize the true picture. Just an FYI the CDC does track gun data regardless of what you have been told. They even played a large part in the gun violence study that Obama wanted after Newtown. Dont believe everything you hear, do some investigating your self, you will be amazed at what you can find.”
Suresp77 on Jun 4, 2014 at 10:31:11
“Edge, its a discussion, relax, not taking it personally. Will say, you pointing out its for the skill that you practice is only increasing my paranoia though LOL. Thanks anyway, will look into CDC Newtown connection.”
“Well then, lets look at some number. 320 million people with 300 million guns. There is an average of 600 accidental gun deaths in the US, 10,000 homicides including justifiable ones. Your odds of getting shot are very very slim. Hardly anything to worry about.”
mgman on Jun 4, 2014 at 09:17:22
“You have some fundamental errors in your statement there...320 million people do NOT own guns. A Pew Research Center survey conducted in February found that 37% of households had an adult who owned a gun — 24% said they owned a gun, and 13% said someone else in their household did. http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/04/a-minority-of-americans-own-guns-but-just-how-many-is-unclear/
If you actually want real numbers regarding firearms and self defense look here:
Justifiable homicides vs criminal homicides - (deaths vs. deaths) the reason this is more accurate is that both result in a guaranteed death, and justifiable homicides function as a serviceable substitute for situations in which the death of the victim is more likely in the absence of a gun. In this case we have 230 justifiable homicides in 2010 vs 8,275 criminal homicides in 2010, which clearly weighs in favor of gun control advocates
Defensive gun use vs crimes committed with a firearm - (uses vs uses). Again, guns were used in self-defense 338,700 times between 2007-2011. In that same five year period, there were 2,277,000 crimes committed with a firearm. Let’s be clear about this: every time a gun was used in self-defense, a criminal committed fatal or non-fatal firearm violence ~7 times.Either way you look at it, offensive gun use far outweighs defensive gun uses, and there is very little evidence validate the claim that guns reliably de-escalate a criminal encounter once it happens. http://www.armedwithreason.com/less-guns-less-crime-debunking-the-self-defense-myth/
The odds look a bit different now.”
Suresp77 on Jun 4, 2014 at 07:09:59
“Except when you add risk factors: I am not white, I am female, in child bearing years. Why do 320 million people have 300 million guns? they are not all hunters? why are they stockpiling somethings whose only purpose is to kill, and yet I am supposed to feel heartened by your statistics, which by the way the CDC is barred from even collecting so no idea if the numbers are true or not.”
“And if you consume alcohol, you are then breaking the law.
When Virginia passed a law a few years ago that made it legal to bring a gun to the bar or a restaurant that serves alcohol, every anti gun person predicted that there would be mass violence and shootings galore. But guess what happened, gun violence went down.
“Obamas gun violence study group that was put together after the Sandyhook shooting to get to the bottom of gun violence said that guns are used approx. 3 million times a year in defense of property and life.
The link I have no longer works but I bet if you looked on google you could find it.
You can also literally spend hours on youtube watching videos of people using firearms in self defense.”
Iluvowls on Jun 3, 2014 at 13:31:57
“so, in other words you cannot provide proof of your claim. GOT IT”
“I wish the penalties for drinking and driving were more severe. Texting and driving deaths are right up there with DUI related deaths. Seems like driving or being near a road way is the most dangerous thing one can do.”
“Could you give me just one example of that ever happening?
coventryk on Jun 8, 2014 at 12:25:24
“My friend Tony, a well-regarded pharmacist and poet, a pillar of his Southern community, with whom I used to debate the 2nd Amendment, which he defended ardently. Ardently. Then in his late '40s, he got into a property dispute with his local neighborhood association, which he lost. One Saturday morning, the neighborhood association president, who lived next door to Tony, and another disputant were chatting in the yard. Tony shot and killed both of them, then holed himself up in his house. The police talk with him for five hours, but in the end, he killed himself too. Until that incident, NO ONE would have predicted what he did. Now two women are widows and two girls don't have fathers. In this year alone, I personally was affected by three unexpected gun deaths, none of them cause by outside bad guys but by the ease of having guns at hand. A total of seven people died. And please don't give me the old "any other weapon would have done as well." Guns make it quicker and easier than anything else.
A thousand people using a gun to save their lives, as you quote below, is a trickle compared to the thousands of murders and suicides committed with guns.”
Think before you send on Jun 3, 2014 at 23:53:49
“James Eagan Holmes- Aurora theater shooter
Jared Laughner _Gabby Giffords shooter
Aaron Alexis- Navy Yard Shooter
Wade Michael Page- Sikh Temple shooter
Seung-Hui Cho - Virginia Tech Shooter
Charles Roberts IV - Amish School Shooter
All people who legally bought guns due to little or no laws to prevent them. All these folk (in the eyes of the NRA) were "good guys" until a couple of seconds after they opened fire on others. Then they are the "bad guys".
“Couldnt agree more Tim. Just because something is a right doesnt mean you can do what ever you want.
In regards to the 2nd Amendment, there is a lot of case law from the supreme courts that have determined what can an cannot be done and the scope of it.
A lot of people would disagree about testing and training as a requirement to purchasing a gun or a least a first time buyer. I how ever would not be against it. I spent time in the military and was a firearms instructor and now Im in a career that requires me to carry gun and I do a lot of training, So Im a huge supporter of training as I know first hand how crucial training and knowing your equipment is.
The hard part would be to convince the other 100 million plus gun owners.”