Access To Information Act: Would More Transparency From MPs Uncover Misspent Funds?

Access To Information Canada

First Posted: 01/30/2012 7:23 am Updated: 01/30/2012 3:41 pm

OTTAWA — Should you have the right to know how much your member of Parliament expensed yesterday for lunch? Or how they spent their housing allowance? Or what salaries they pay their staff?

Former Bloc Quebecois leader Gilles Duceppe’s alleged misuse of his parliamentary budget to pay the salaries of people employed by his political party has led to growing calls for MPs to be included under the Access to Information Act — federal legislation that would force parliamentarians to open up their books and release internal documents.

Duff Conacher, the founding board member of Democracy Watch, said he believes Duceppe’s spending would have been uncovered if MPs were subject to the Access to Information program (ATIP).

“Definitely, the patterns that we have seen in England and Nova Scotia of some of them abusing their budgets and resources of their offices would have been seen at the federal level,” Conacher told The Huffington Post Canada.

“Right now MPs’ offices and budgets are ripe for abuse because the Access to Information Act does not apply and there is no disclosure ... through Auditor General audit of what they are spending their money on,” he added.

The Montreal newspaper La Presse reported last week that for years Duceppe used his parliamentary budget to pay the salaries of his party’s general manager and others employed to do work for the Bloc Quebecois.

Duceppe told La Presse he acted within the rules, but parliamentarians of all stripe have come out to say that it is very clear to them that the former Bloc leader breached protocol and should have known better.

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If MPs were included in the Access to Information Act, Canadians would be able to find out what their representatives actually spend their money on, the Canadian Taxpayers Federation’s Gregory Thomas told HuffPost.

“(The House of Commons) just published tables showing many MPs spent six, seven, eight, $9,000 on hospitality in the last year. I don’t think anybody believes that part of an MP’s job is picking up the bar tabs,” he said.

“It’s public funds and if you want to use the public’s money then you have to tell the public what you are doing with the money.”

Parliamentarians should follow the lead of Toronto City councillors who post all their expenses, including receipts, online, Thomas argued. Expanding access laws to include MPs would just be the first step, he said.

“I think it’s inevitable” Thomas said. “I trust the public to demand it.”

NDP MP Linda Duncan said she wasn’t aware parliamentarians weren’t included under a law that allows the public to request any documents from government departments.

“To tell you the truth, I wasn’t aware that we weren’t covered, it probably should be something that should be looked into. I certainly have no reason to not be disclosing things that go on,” she said.

But some of her colleagues disagree.

Conservative MP Pierre Poilievre said he is open to having “full accountability and transparency” in the way MPs spend their money but he questioned what benefit subjecting members to the Access to Information law would add.

“Probably three-quarters of an MP’s budget goes to staff, another 10 to 15 per cent goes to office rent, so you would really be examining the remaining 10 to 15 per cent most of which is already public through reporting. So I’m curious, if someone were to propose to apply ATIP to an MP’s office, I’d like to know exactly what additional information they could acquire that is not already available to them, and so far I haven’t seen an example,” he said.

Some MPs suggested placing them under the Act would inundate their small offices with requests for documents, monopolizing their staff's time and preventing them from dealing with legislative work, constituency files or answering correspondence.

If MPs were subject to the Act, one Conservative MP told HuffPost, their offices would not only be flooded with requests from the public but from MPs themselves.

“If someone attacked you in the House, you’d swamp that damn bugger’s office with requests,” the member said.

NDP MP Jack Harris said he doesn’t think MPs should be subjected to the law because a lot of the work an MP does should remain confidential.

Above an beyond constituent files — which would likely be censored for release under the access program because of privacy laws — Harris argued parliamentarians straddle a gray zone of discussing on the one hand, public policy work and on the other, plotting partisan strategy and tactics that shouldn’t be released to the public.

While MPs know they shouldn’t pay political party staff from their budgets, allowing them to sit in on meetings and share information is perfectly normal and those discussions should be kept private, he said.

The Conservative Party’s director of political operation Jenni Byrne’s regular appearances at meetings with top PMO directors should be “expected,” Harris said, suggesting the NDP operates in a similar fashion.

“Sometimes it is difficult to sort out but obviously political parties are about political strategy and the Prime Minister’s Office is no different, I assume, than our office or the offices of (other) opposition parties,” Harris said.

“The political party makes decisions on how to spend its money and what campaigns to undertake and there is no doubt they talk to the people who are elected about that. But you know, there is a grey area,” he said.

Conacher, the former head of Democracy Watch, is sensitive to the concern and believes parliamentarians should be given a limited exemption under the Access law to confidentially carry out their partisan duties.

That would only be fair, argued Liberal MP Mauril Bélanger, since ministers’ offices and the Prime Minister’s Office are not covered under the Access to Information Act.

“If we want more transparency, I have no problem with that but it must apply equally to the executive wing of government not just the legislative branch,” he said.

The Supreme Court of Canada ruled last spring that ministers and the prime minister can’t be forced to release items such as their date books or private emails to their staff.

The court ruled that PM's office and those of the cabinet are separate from the bureaucratic departments they head and therefore were excluded under the law — a position that Bélanger completely disagrees with.

“In my opinion, when you look at Annex 1 (of the Act) ... ministries are included there. And if you look at the definition of a ministry, it includes a minister,” he said.

Bélanger said he personally wouldn’t be interested in reading communications between ministers’ offices but that some ministerial briefing notes and documents should be part of the public domain.

“Most of those (emails) deal with questions of strategy, questions of politics, what I’m interested in is substantial items such as research documents that are drafted in preparation for new laws, the strategy, a lot of that is excluded and I really disagree with that. But as far as details of correspondence between colleagues and all that, you know at some point, we need to be able to work,” he said.

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OTTAWA — Should you have the right to know how much your member of Parliament expensed yesterday for lunch? Or how they spent their housing allowance? Or what salaries they pay their staff? Form...
OTTAWA — Should you have the right to know how much your member of Parliament expensed yesterday for lunch? Or how they spent their housing allowance? Or what salaries they pay their staff? Form...
 
 
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12:04 PM on 01/31/2012
This is hilariously false, and it's no wonder Duff and his "Democracy Watch" group never caught on. You can go to http://www.parl.gc.ca/PublicDisclosure/MemberExpenditures.aspx?Language=E&Year=2010-2011 right now and view every single MP's expenses for the last fiscal year. Putting them under ATI policy is pointless when they already freely post this information online.
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BCSLAVE
Got a key?
09:31 PM on 01/31/2012
And do you think they post everything? Peter Mckay doesn't. Clements certainly doesn't. G20 spending - border security funds diverted for pork barreling and personal gain. Even the auditor said it wasn't up front.

You believe what politicians tell you? If so you are naive or a Reform troll.
08:36 AM on 02/01/2012
What information do you have to suggest that McKay or Clement are hiding their expenses?

Again, you simply don't understand the process. This is not free money that's thrown at an MP and they're told to go nuts. This is money they first pay out of pocket, THEN they submit their receipts and expenses to a non-partisan parliamentary office for reimbursement. If their expenses meet the criteria, the MP is reimbursed and those totals are posted on the public disclosure link above.

Unless you have evidence to suggest they're hiding something, stop with such a ridiculous assumption.
11:36 AM on 01/31/2012
I cannot understand why you are not doing it, crazy, who would trust a politician, look what we found in the UK 4 MP's went to gaol for fraud and probly another 40 slipped the noose.
They are public servants (in theory) how can they NOT come clean on what they cost? unless they have a lot to hide.
11:11 AM on 01/31/2012
sure as long as we include the PMO and privy council
07:16 AM on 01/31/2012
thet scammed 50 million with impunity --------so free lunches are a given
07:14 AM on 01/31/2012
and dont forget to include the senators.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
jimbo123
12:22 AM on 01/31/2012
The anti-greed thinking (1st cousin to OWS) continues to roll! Holy Cow! If this continues there won't be any way for a dishonest pol to make a living!
09:13 PM on 01/30/2012
why this is not even overseen before is a question. Like isnt there some sort of median that most politicians spend, and when ones spending seems to go way over shouldnt they be questioned and looekd into?
12:07 PM on 01/31/2012
Members have an annual Operating Budget of $284,000 per year. That's $284,000 for bills, salaries, office supplies, maintenance and repairs, hospitality, and so forth.

It's not like MP's are just thrown money and told "go nuts." They have to first pay their expense from their own pocket, then they submit receipts for reimbursement to the responsible Parliamentary officer (a neutral person, not a member of any party).
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BCSLAVE
Got a key?
09:35 PM on 01/31/2012
You clearly had blinders on when Tony Clements was going nuts and throwing money around town for his upcoming re-election bid. He's another Nucky Thompson.
12:35 AM on 02/01/2012
so then why are these stories of wild spending all ways making news then?
This comment has been removed.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Tyler Austin
Women = people. Corperations ≠ people.
02:02 PM on 01/30/2012
My MP is Tony Clement. So the short answer is no.

You ask him what the weather is like outside and he calls up Baird to answer for him! :/
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
SeanMartin
Everything in moderation.
12:46 PM on 01/30/2012
Why is this even open for debate? Whose money is it that they're throwing around?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
KNW
12:28 PM on 01/30/2012
Every cent they spend should be on the public record, and that record should be mailed out to every one of their constituents come election time.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
scratchingmyhead
01:34 PM on 01/30/2012
or @ least posted online.
08:40 AM on 02/01/2012
1. Every cent is posted online already. The link is posted above.

2. Do you know how expensive it would be to mail financial records to every Canadian in every riding come election time? It would easily double the cost of an election, which already costs $30 million!
georgee2
My Canada Includes Everyone
11:52 AM on 01/30/2012
They all have their noses firmly planted in the public trough, both federal and provincial.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cameron d
Good Guys Win
10:42 AM on 01/30/2012
What we should be doing is demanding that our Government not spend hundreds of billions of dollars on net fighter jets and prison upgrades when the evidence tells us we don't need those things.

It's a nice thought to think that curbing MP spending would make a difference, but it's just a drop in the bucket. This Conservative government is wasting our money.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cameron d
Good Guys Win
10:51 AM on 01/30/2012
I don't know why I typed the word "net" into the first paragraph. Wow, what was I doing? Still the rest of that is what I believe.
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BCSLAVE
Got a key?
07:09 PM on 01/30/2012
And get rid of the pensions for them...give them basic RRSPs. To hell with them raping the taxpayer like under the current scheme were they contribute 1 dollar and the taxpayer contributes 23 dollars....should be the other way round at least and it should be retro active.

Under the current MP pension plan, Harper's cats will eat better than seniors!!!
10:25 AM on 01/30/2012
Conservative governments are always SUPPOSED to be about cutting spending, cutting costs and being fiscally responsible with tax dollars. They, if anyone, should be pushing for more transparency and accountability for how they spend funds. Then again, politicians seem to be a class of overly entitled and you aren't going to see them EVER say, "Maybe we don't need to fly first class or take private planes. Maybe we DON'T need to hold meetings at 5 star restaurants and then pay the tab for everyone in attendance. And Maybe we don't need to always stay at 5 star resort hotels when there is a perfectly acceptable "family" hotel.

The way I see it, when politicians of any party think that it is acceptable or "common practice" to stay where the majority of citizens can't....they are already showing how out of touch they are with the average voter. I would further argue, that by only flying first class, or private, or staying/eating ultra expesive places, they are actually isolating themselves or avoiding the "normal people" who are probably more of a nuisance or "the rabble" in their minds.
This comment has been removed.
12:42 PM on 01/31/2012
Our government is cutting spending and will eliminate the deficit by 2015. And you can see what individual MP's have spent for the past several years online. See my post below.
03:01 PM on 01/31/2012
Eliminate the deficit by 2015? The deficits they are creating? And while they talk about cutting all kinds of valuable social programs that help society and keep it sustainable, they certainly aren't making any effort to cut their own personal spending or to have open bidding on jets. Jets, may I remind you, that even the US is pulling away from because they are over priced and under reliable.

Remind me again how much they spent on the G8 summit? Building an indoor lake right beside a real lake?

Like all conservative governments over the past 30 years, they run up massive deficits/debt, think they can solve the problem by cutting social programs which only hurts the poor and increases the number who slip into poverty which reduces revenues in the future and therefore more cuts keep coming.

Meanwhile, very few ever stop and wonder what it says about our society when 65+. 70+ year olds or older have to keep working just to get by. This is conservative's idea of "success", but personally all I see is a massive failure in social and economic policy. Further proven by the fact the gap between rich and poor keep increasing in canada and for the first time in a long time, normal worker wages have stagnated while Corporations and CEOs report record profits/bonuses.

The conservatives think Canada's future should be the US. The problem is that they fail to see what is actually happening over there.
10:07 AM on 01/30/2012
It is OUR money that they are spending so we have every right to know! We are sinking in Federal debt and it's time that our representatives show some empathy with Canadians by taking a pay cut and opening their budgets for public inspection. If malfeasance is detected, reprimand the criminals and subject them to fraud laws.